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Undertale
| And, like, idk. I'd just like to talk candidly with you g/u/rls about it. I feel like it's been long enough to where people will actually say their honest opinions of it instead of just either "holy shit best game ever snans hilsrrtious ahahagstyahaa" or "undertal is cancer incarnate".
So, what do you g/u/rls think about the game?
Fun and unique RPG, or boring and not for you?
What do you think the game does right, and what do you think it could have done better?
| Every sufficiently big fandom will form a toxic subsection. That's just how it is unfortunately.
I actually don't think it's "short enough to not overstay its welcome". I feel like it drags too much, and I dropped it after a couple of hours.
But I picked it up again later and it gets better towards the end. when I get to the ending, I just... I want to hold and carry the game with me forever.
| >>749444 I would normally say the same, but then I look at The Binding Of Isaac and Hollow Knight fandoms and ask myself why these "creepy" games gets the most beautiful non-toxic fandoms ever existed.
Undertale is a masterpiece, but it released at the worst time, the high pick meme era of the Internet. The game breaks so many standards and typical things fiction would always have and add new ones to the story of fiction. But people liked those that much the memes overflowed.
| Just think about classics like Star Wars, it was loved back in the day and still loved for many years despite nowadays it's memezied and pariodied everywhere (like even Japanese culture has many references to SW in animes despite the few other references to western creations). Of course it has it flaws and is not perfect (nothing is) but people love it. Imagine if it was released for the first time during the last 5 years. I mean the new media SW gets it's kind of suffering that.
| >>749444
Huh. I guess I can kinda see how you might drop it in, like, waterfalls maybe. But, that place is so beautiful that I don't mind the slower pacing and puzzles, and after your first time getting through it takes, like, no time.
That last paragraph is a little confusing, but I think I understand.
>>749448
Yeah the time it released probably had something to do with it but I think it was also the right time in a way. Like, I can't imagine Undertale releasing today, you know?
| Also, I just wanna say that I think more game developers should learn from Undertale. It did some things that more games should do.
For example, how every playthrough is a little different. Even though it's mostly just a few lines of dialogue here and there and the FUN values, just the fact that you can play through the same game multiple times and it's always gonna have a few changes here and there despite the fact that it's story based just adds so much to it.
| It makes the world feel more alive in a way. Like, imagine if more games did that. Even if it's just minor stuff like the first time you meet the main villain being a little later or a little earlier, or some NPCs here and there having slightly different dialogue every time you play through it or a few side quests not always being the same. Like, I think RPGs in general should do more stuff like that.
| I am personally scared that it took one or two years for UT fandom to do the amount of things that Sonic fandom did. I'm into Sonic more and I didn't become a part of any UT community although I liked the game and bunch of fanmade stuff.
| >>749510
Sonic is a lot worse imo.
Undertale community is the weird autistic kid in the back of the classroom drawing alternate universe versions of the characters he's weirdly obsessed with, while awkwardly making jokes that nobody laughs at.
Sonic community is the weird 28 year old man who's for some reason sitting in the back of your middle school classroom, surrounded by porn mags and note books and showing the kids his "Sonic impregnates Tails???" comic that he drew.
| Who cares what fans do as long as their not hurting anyone. With a lot of media people seem to review the fandom instead of the game. Thought we moved past this debate after 2015.
| >>749572 People always cherry pick that stuff too. Nobody cares about the amazing fan content from games art or remixes. No they have to travel to the ass end of the Internet to find something terrible because that content drives clicks
| >>749572 >>749574
I completely agree with you. I don't think a piece of media should be judged by it's fanbase, which is why I said what I did in OP post.
I don't mind talking about fandoms either though. It's entertaining. But they're separate from the media imo.
| >>749514 bruh that sonic description literally applies to ut fandom tho ut fandom is dying as opposed to sonic
| Regarding the Sonic fandom, all I will say is that we are one of the best examples of Laissez-Faire in videogames.
The fandom will go far and beyond in order to do the things Sega won't, or can't do.
| That soundtrack from the OVA that was never released? Fans remade it from scratch.
Those beta versions lost to time? Fans found them.
Arguably the best game since like... Generations? Fans did it. Hell, that's the motto of the game.
Yeah, half of the fans are degenerates, but the other half is keeping the franchise alive.
| Anyways. Undertale.
I will be boring and will answer with two questions.
Does Undertale fulfill it's job as a game? And as a piece of art?
First one is easy. If fun, then yes, if boring, then no.
As a piece of art, does it deliver the message it wants to deliver, and does this message have any lasting result in the player?
| >>749429
Undertale was loads of fun & a unique game, but after doing neutral & pacifist, I didn't bother to replay it. If there was a good fanbase I might've stayed hooked for a bit longer.
For the fanbase, I think most cringey fanbases have something in common: Lots of kids.
Gaming YTbers played Undertale & milked it so dry it got erectile dysfunction--and once a crit. mass of cringe was reached, it became self-sustaining.
So. Many. Fanfics. And stans,
oh god, the incest stans.
| Aight, so, my original intent for the thread was to talk exclusively about the game, but I guess this is a "bashing fandoms" thread now. Can't say I'm not to blame for participating, so, have fun.
| >>749617 don't be such a fag op. If you can't handle people in your threads then don't even make them lol
| >>749633
I changed the topic of the thread. I'm literally embracing it. You're not wrong that I'm a fag by definition, but you're autistic if you managed to misinterpret my message that badly lol
| I thought it was fine. Like most games though, I don't interact with the fanbase. Fanbases tend to be cancer nowadays.
| >>749637 not only you're gay but you also think that if you said something and people didn't get it makes them wrong.
| >>749711
If I said something, you didn't understand it and then said something as if you knew what I said, then yes. That response was objectively wrong.
Also, you're really using gay as an insult nowadays? That's just kinda sad. Like, objectively just sad.
| y'all toxic af, maids close this thread and ban everyone, including me :3
| >>749759
I'm sorry! I was being a bit mean. I was in a bad mood so I decided to interact with the bait posts to let some of it out. I'm a bad influence :(
| it wouldn't be called DANGEROUS opinions for nothing
| Games that expect you to replay the game to get the full picture are hit and miss.
It worked on nier automata for me since I like the gameplay and world. But undertale... nah, I don't like the battle system, don't like the graphics, and I don't want to go through the same unfuny jokes for the second time.
| >>750012
You don't have to do multiple playthroughs to get the full picture. You can do it if you want to see multiple sides of the same story or if you enjoy meta commentary, but one playthrough really is all you need and all that's expected.
| >>750020
You do have to do at least 2 playthroughs - neutral and pacifist. At the end of neutral route you pretty much literally get told "this isn't really the ending, don't kill anyone to get the actual ending" and unless you've been embracing your inner hippie the entire time on your first run (which is unlikely) you really will have to do it all again.
>>750012
In Nier Automata the second playthrough (i.e. Route B) is different enough and much shorter than Route A, so it works
| >>750044
It's not "this isn't really the ending". It's "there are other endings". A game having multiple endings doesn't mean you have to get all of them. That's, a weird mindset.
| >>750053
Genocide ending is "the other ending." And the end of the neutral ending you get absolutely zero closure and you get *explicitly* told that if you want a real ending, you have to go through it all again, but as pacifist.
Calling it a proper ending is like calling a game over an ending.
To bring the Nier Automata example back, it's like only finishing Route A and going "welp, I'm done, no why anyone praises the plot so much though." Or stopping after any of the joke endings
| >>750056 It's not rare that many games treat a Game Over as an ending, mostly in a humorous and sarcastic way (Disgaea ones are really good, worth the achievement) Or Metal Gear Solid 3 which literally Game Overs you if you commit a paradox. But normally a Game Over consist on a player failling, Undertale's genocide ending is not making the player lose at any time.
| At the end, an Ending is what the player choose to believe in or cases like Undertale, 999 and Zero Escape that wants to go deeper onto parallel stories and affecting the other endings in some way. Cyberpunk 2077 has a suicide ending and many people took that ending seriously. There is also the Zelda case, which literally creates a whole timeline out of a supposed Game Over the player may never have.
| >>750058
>Undertale's genocide ending is not making the player lose at any time
Congratulations, you have completely missed my entire point.
| Undertale was good, but not special for me. The RPG gameplay was not super engaging, and the art and world design is boring as fuck. The music and story were better. And the characters were undeniably its strongest suit.
I played the neutral and pacifist endings, and by the end of the second one, I was thoroughly bored. While the story is well replayable, the combat system is not. The reduced health was not quite enough to make the bullet-hell worth a second time through...
| and ended up just becoming a hindrance closer to the end. I got sick to death of the random encounters. That being said, the combat system was great in bossfights, especially the first time through. I think just some combat changes on the pacifist run would have made it a lot more interesting for me.
| My overall assessment is that it approached being one of the god-tier indie games that connect their gameplay, story, and message. But the gameplay had fallen off right before the game finished, so it couldn't quite get there.
| With regards to fandoms: Rather than the normal way of fandom forming happening for this game, a large part of the Undertale fandom was imported as a preexisting community from Tumblr. This same group of people has migrated between a few different fandoms as their own self-contained group. So, I don't think the fandom's problems had anything to do with Undertale or that this fandom was even very similar to other toxic fandoms.
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| The game has been memed to all hell. The fanbase is, "special". Everyone knows everything about it to the point where the charm has worn off for a lot of people.
But, honestly, I think the game holds up, and despite the fact that the fanbase is the definition of autism, the game still has a special place in my heart.
It has replay value, it has really solid characters and a cool world, it's short enough to where it doesn't overstay it's welcome, and it's just sick.