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A question for Indonesian folks
| Damn for real? My dream of marrying Moona Hoshinova has been destroyed :(
| I don't think there's any law about it, but cross-religion marriage is frowned upon in general. It just makes things difficult, you know?
Some civil bureaucracy (marriage, inheritance) are managed by religion-based ministries. Plenty of muslims only identify as such for bureaucratic purpose, but don't participate in the religion. Depending on the community, this is either frowned on, or not a big deal at all.
| Personal opinion, but with religion being a large part of life here, it's important for a couple to be on the same terms about their faith, you know? Having different beliefs, different holidays, different praying methods is gonna make a mess of daily life.
Not that cross-religion marriage doesn't happen, just that it's rare and complicated. Muslim men marrying non-muslim is a tiny bit more acceptable than the other way around, for uhh, complicated reasons.
| >>837785 do we actually know her religious views? I would think most vtubers aren't muslim, although they might just be agnostic muslim with a devout family. the family part is really the important thing as if you didn't care about that you wouldn't worry about it in the first place (your parter to-be would most likely care, being Indonesian and all)
| >>837830 I should probably have said that with more care. There are at least a couple Niji ID vtubers that I would assume are devout muslims.
| 1. Marriages in Indonesian culture are not only about individuals, but also between families. Your indonesian gurl might be okay marrying a guy from different religion, but her family probably won't. You'll need to find very progressive g/u/rl with a very progressive family, which is very rare.
2. If the gurl is a non-practicing muslim, and her family somehow doesn't care, then you can convince her to change her religion to yours instead. Again, this is very rare.
| 3. You can use a loophole, which is marrying the gurl at other countries that are cool with cross-religion; Singapore for example. No idea how you'd deal with the paper work afterwards, but it has been commonly exploited by public figures and politicians.
4. Be aware of scams, this is just a general advice for anyone trying to find a relationship in other countries, really. Don't hust send monet because the gurl asked.
5. Don't try having parasocial relationship with net idols
| Hmm seems to not be worth it unless you really love the person. Pretty interesting culture but seems a little too strict
| >>838053 I'm just thinking about the pros and cons if some scenario like that happens where I somehow end up in a relationship with an Indonesian girl. It seems like for the people who are more religious they prefer to date someone they will most likely marry so you'd probably have to think about such things before things progress any further assuming you find someone you like from there
| >>838053
It's an alien concept for us in the west but in some countries(and historically the west) you marry for more reasons than romantic love, like your love for your family and the prosperity a good marriage brings. I also think some people(most?) can learn to love someone romantically if they really want to.
But I dunno, it's not like I have any first hand experience with anything I just talked about.
| >>838077
I'm Indonesian, so don't lump me in with this "us in the west" thing.
Fair point, though. I was thinking that, if you're doing cross-religion marriage specifically, it's either you love them enough to go through all the hoops, or you shouldn't marry them at all.
| >>838060
As a religious Indonesian g/u/rl, this is correct (tho I can't speak for everyone). I would consider marriage possibilities early.
If I end up dating someone with a different religion, I'd have a long hard look early on if it's worth it, if we can see eye to eye about our faiths eventually. Sometimes it's best to nip a relationship in the bud.
As an aside, there are so many soap operas and romance novels about this specific issue. It's not an unheard of thing.
| So what I'm getting from this thread is that if I court an Indonesian girl, and we fall in love, then we can either flee the country to be married OR I must become a silver-tongued devil to charm the hearts of her parents? Sounds sick. I'm in.
Also, are younger Indonesians just as religious as the generations before them? Where I live the youth are vastly less religious than their parents. So like... millennials to gen z are much closer to agnostic.
| >>838092
Sorry, I didn't mean to speak for anyone but myself. I was just clumsily highlighting the fact that it's a very alien concept in the western world(and probably many other places but I wouldn't know much about that, being european and all).
| >>838098
My aunt married an agnostic German man and still get invited to family events, so you can do it g/u/rl lol.
>are younger Indonesians just as religious as the generations before them?
Ooh this is a complicated question. From my perspective (progressive city girl raised by mildly religious but open-minded parents), religion is only recently (last 30 years or so) taken seriously. Something to do with the purging of the communists in 1960s, maybe.
/cont
| But by religion, I mean more like islam/christianity as it's practiced overseas. We used to have a lot of local beliefs and superstition, only some of which still sits side by side with "modern" religion today.
So the younger generation is simultaneously more religious, as in adhering better to these "modern" religions, but also more liberal and open to outside values. Plenty of new agnostics/atheists here too.
/cont
| There are extremes on both sides, and it'll still depend on where you're asking (Indonesia is huge, mind), but that's the sense that I'm getting.
Boomers are still boomers though. e.g. you *have* to declare a religion in your identification card. Being an atheist is not yet accepted by the state
And despite me saying "recent", the modern religions in some form have always been important. Religious orgs are major supporters during the war for independence in 1940s, for example.
| Ok that was a bit more words than I expected. Please take these with a grain of salt though. I'm not a historian and I'm just one g/u/rl and I know I'm still missing a lot of context (like, I'm definitely missing perspectives from hindus/buddhists/confucianists!)
| >>838049 it really depends on how devout/conservative the girl and her family, really. Bali is a province in indonesia in which the population is mostly hindus. Tourism is their main source of income, and you can see more foreiners marrying the locals.
The culture doesn't end with marriage either, you'd have to deal with family gatherings that you expect to attend and then deal with nosey uncle/aunt medling with your private life.
| It's probably better for you to convince the girl and her family to change her nationality and live in your country, so that you don't have to deal with the culture.
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| I am curious does your country really require none Muslim men to convert to marry an Indonesian woman? How do people over there really feel about that if so?