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Cancel Culture is Cancer Culture
| Who are you referring to?
| source?
| Idk about 12 and 10, but there have been cancelings for 19 and 17, like wtf, have you not seen that in highschool
| This referring to the whole CallmeCarson situation?
| Yank culture is cancer culture
| I'll be taking a shot every time I see someone say "yank" lol
| Yank.
| Why so butt hurt anyway?
| Sanctioning other countries for political reasons is also "cancel culture". But many people in the US who are upset about cancel culture in the inner are very fine with it for the outer. Because it's against "the fucking communists" (or at least against everything that is portrayed this way by propaganda)
As long the USA sanction other countries, I celebrate how their "cancel culture" slowly destroys their "freedom" (which is build on unfree peoples backs after all)
| The USA are cancer.
| >>729326 This isn't about sanctioning countries, it's just dumb social media drama on the internet. Don't take it too personal dude
| Imagine thinking that cancel culture is only in the USA lol
| Just people in their own echo chambers
| >>729261 always has been
2 years difference is nothing, if is someone underage of legal age, they can wait
| >>729365 19, and 17 doesn't seem like a problem. But say if the person who's 19 had nude photos of the 17 year old; or younger--then it becomes a huge problem
| >>729402 if it becomes a problem the monment there is nudes in it then I ask you, how do you stop horny irrational teens from consentualy sending nudes?
| >>729333
For me these things are related to each other. In the end we have institutions led by people who make decisions concerning people who have absolutely no influence on these institutions. People in Latin America, the near and the middle east didn't elect CIA, NATO or US Military leaders like people in the USA haven't elected the leaders of the monopolistic tech companies.
I find censorship a bad thing. But I also find people in the USA deserve it (plus even worse things.)
| >>729402 where is not plaintiff, there is not judger.. if they keep this thing in secret and both of them are ok about it, i don't see problem here
| >>729479
The government in my country is as corrupt and incompetent as yours. But I'm fine with it as long they manage to keep US soldiers and agents out of the country who want to "liberate" it - traditionally with an even more corrupt and incompetent plus bloodthirsty puppet dictator.
I laugh at seeing how the USA as the once so proud and victorious superpower and self-appointed bringer of liberty suffers now from its own rotten, ignorant, hypocritical and presumptuous policy.
| This whole "Make america great again" thing is nothing but the crying of conservative babies who don't have the tiniest clue of what is going on. Trump is the ideal personification of this inferiority complex which seeks/promises a better future in an idealized fantasy version of a past which never existed this way.
| And his success shows how massively rotten this society is from the core. He just accelerated the downfall of the US Empire. I'm not sure if Biden will ever be able to fix this mess. And I'm not sure if I want it to be fixed. I actually enjoy how democracy in the USA slowly gets disrupted due to the growing political polarization and social/economical inequality. A doomed class society.
| >>729636 still, dont complain when democracy in your country slowly gets disrupted due to the growing political polarization and social/economical inequality.
| All I wanted to talk about is how dumb it was Carson got cancelled. How do you people always manage to derail it to talk about capitalism and the U.S.
| >>729655 well that explains it, they are truly getting the worst of this globaly wide political devide and cancel culture problem
| >>729648 didn't he get cancelled for using his fame and position of power to groom a 17 yo fan into sending him nudes? I don't see anything wrong with cancelling that. If he was just dating a girl and that was it, i'd probably defend him, but from what it was more than that.
| >>729686 he never directly used his influence, the girl was really onto him and even said that despite thinking that she shouldnt do this she said that she wanted to do it anyways, the only thing Carson did wrong was not thinking in the long run but hey horng teens will keep being horny
| People are just dumb and dont notice how this whole shit is world wide problem, itss affecting south america, europe, its starting to be noticed by asia, its not USA exclusive its just stronger there and we cant pin point where it started but it is a problem that probably was started by companies that control big sites
| >>729686 He was 19 and at 10k subs at the time, hardly an established and/or trusted denizen of YouTube. Also, 'grooming' a 17 year old? Sure.
| >>729717
Stop responding to people you think are derailing your thread, and just focus on people who are responding to your topic.
| >>729733 why is a mod even responding to that? Dont you got better stuff to do?
Also, why does that even make you angry in the first place? Never told anyone that they are derailing a thread, its just that that talk about USA and capitalism is saturated, although it is relates but I wont stop people if they want to do it
| >>729725 yes it is but its under a whole other set of problems, itsmore about their own culture unlike other places where the issue came from the ideological conlficts
| >>729776 Because they want to preserve the quality of discussion? Well, I suppose it really is too much to expect any of that from /new/ lmao
| >>729800 well it got burried by other replies so it wasnt even mattering, complaining about that would be and is more distracting
| >>729776
>its just that that talk about USA and capitalism is saturated
It's a fact that as long the USA are a world leading political/military superpower and there is a global hegemony of capitalism, those things are related to any social, economical and cultural phenomenons and issues.
Stating that everything was said about it is just an opinion. And generally wanting to exclude any comments that point to the mentioned fact for "derailing" or "distracting" would be censorship.
| >>729847 and I never said it was derailing and I even said that I wont stop anyone from talking about it, I just complained that it is a saturated topic and the thread is more about the hole cancelling CallmeCarson thing
| The "cancel culture" which currently is spreading in the "western world" is a phenomenon that orignated in the USA.
Btw. I find the hint, that there also exists a "cancel culture" in asia (with a much longer tradition) an important contribution to the debate, which adds a new and also not unimportant aspect to the topic, regarding the west-to-east powershift.
| Well it actually started when sjws became thing on the internet and what made sjws pop in reality? I dont know
| >>729850
>and what made sjws pop in reality
It's easy: social injustice...
Also the people being called "sjws" didn't come from the internet. They come from US-Universities were post-structuralist philosophies and identity politics started dominating the critical discourse about society. Legitmate criticism on those developments was soon successfully appropriated by far-right groups.
| I don't like the term "SJW", because it's word twisting and full of wrong implications. For instance it implies that social justice is in general something bad or that there is no injustice at all. And it also generally condemns anyone who fights for social justice for being either a mislead naive idiot or a hypocrite who secretly only wants the worst for all or a certain group.
| In my opinion the nihilist/misantropic world views behind terms like "SJW" are a result of the injustice and hypocrisy that actually exist in liberal societies, despite (not because) the fight against injustice it proudly proclaims.
The comeback of the far-right isn't only a failure of how our liberal societies are build. It's also the failure of left groups who stopped to articulate fundamental criticism to the system and started prioritizing the issues horribly wrong.
| White hetero-normative males may be in a privileged situation compared to non-white non-hetero-normative non-males in a corresponding social/economic status.
The problem is that what divides people the most after all is exactly this social/economic status. And this division is rapidly increasing. All other conflicts that occur between ethnical, sexual and cultural groups are subordinated to the one big major conflict between economic classes.
| And this big determining conflict under the surface also started affecting a significant increasing number of white people, despite their historical privilege heritage. Most of them belong to the middle class, which is eroding rapidly. So they're loosing their privileges while at the same time being told being privileged by left liberal intelectuals (who are usually privileged themselves).
| >>4060bc Hi I think Im in love, wanna be best friends?
Jokes aside yeah I get all that Im just wondering why these ideas were propagated in the first place?
| >>729868
Now I'm a bit embarrassed ^^"
Well, it's not like these ideas are wrong and rotten from the core. But they got over-prioritized whhich for sure has multiple reasons.
Imho most mentionable ones:
1 The downfall of the soviet union.
It caused delusion and a paradigm shift within the political left
2 mass psychology
Left-liberal identity politics have at least one thing in common with right ideology: It gets pretty well along with stereotypization and oversimplification.
| IdPol ruined the left
Change my mind
| >>729870 yeah and I just wish companies and the government of not only USA but from the whole world would not try to profit from it, they just put more gasonline on the fire and accuse one side of being evil and glorify the other when in reality both are have hipocrisy, grifters, extremists, and bad ideas, instead of taking the good side from both parts they choose to just keep highlighting the bad and making people more devided
| ok, what i meant was when you use BS words like heteronormative i cannot take you seriously at all, plus most of the other things you've claimed show a pretty clear leftist bias, so...
| >>729871 I don't really disagree with you, but I'll try to change your mind anyways:
most idpol-related ideas are reasonable and based on an understanding of actual leftism. however, the people who talk about these ideas the most use them in such a condescending way that it may as well be a different idea. the best example is the use of the 'intellectual labor' idea. what it's supposed to be is pointing out that someone who is expected to repeatedly explain their lack of...
| privilege is spending their time/labor on it, in the same way a disabled person might take more time/labor to perform certain tasks. it's pretty reasonable, I'd think. certain people use this idea, though, as a way to condescendingly deflect all arguments by saying "you dumb bitch, go educate yourself, lamoa." so if I had to contest the statement that idpol ruined the left, I'd say it's those certain peoples' condescension that's doing the ruining.
| >>3e61c1 in his defense, he seem to be left leaning and is disappointed at how the extreme left has been acting and reconises the flaws in their actions while understanding their ideas, wich is a very fair and reasonable way of thinking
| >>729884
>the 'intellectual labor' idea
This idea also fundamentally contradicts the idea of "intellectual property", which is rather becoming reality than 'intellectual labor'.
And unfortunately most people who do actual labor aren't that much intellectual. They're more and more specialized idiots and/or being kept stupid thanks to a cheap stupid mass entertainment industry. They are the loosers of a system they don't understand which makes them an easy target for dumb ideas.
| >>465e2d
you read me like a book.
I think there is nothing wrong about being left or right leaning. I would consider myself even as far-left leaning, but not as an extremist. I have many issues with what's being portrayed as "the left" these days. To me most of them are just moderate.
| My biggest problem with most (far-)right leaning people is their dishonesty about where they stand. They often deny where they stand and rather try to portray themselves as "the center" and the only legitimate representation of "the people". And at the same time they see communism behind everything that contradicts their (to me highly questionable) world views.
| >>729883
Which aspect of the term "hetero-normative" is what makes you so suspicious?
However, as already stated in >>729897 I have nor problem admitting being "left leaning" or "leftist". I wouldn't call it a bias, since I know very well where I stand and I don't need to make a secret out of it because I also know why.
I also have no problems dealing with moderate right leaning people, as long they know why and can explain their stance with solid arguments in a civilized way.
| To me the question is, where do people stand who try to tell me Joe Biden is a socialist that drinks the blood of children?
And what's with people who don't know anything about economics and culture that goes beyond disneyland and mcdonalds which suddenly start talking about "cultural marxism" and "globalism"?
Lot's of them say their position is based on reason and pragmatism, being located in the centre. To me this kind of views seem more like entirely made up and arbitrary.
| >>729902 It really dumb how people wanna criticise capitalism but cant even define capitalism or understant how it works, people dont seem to know the value of work, how economy influences, that inflation is a problem, it wont be solved by printing more money and why free things(or super cheap things) are made by the slave labor of someone
| >>729895 whatever it is you're talking about, I don't think it's the same thin, I was talking about
| >>729904
The problem of people criticizing capitalism who don't know how it works is way more rare than the problem of people that ignore the issues capitalism undeniably comes with because they don't understand it at all. At the same time those people put the liberal left all together with the socialist left and create such terms as mentioned in >>729902.
| The ideas behind terms like "cultural marxism" or "globalism" are conspiracy theories mixing up identity politics, marxism and globalization in a inappropriate propagandist way, which hasn't to do much with what those things are in reality.
| I think cancel culture came about after seeing so many pieces of shit blatantly get away with their shit for decades, sometimes even getting more opportunities after their scandals. The next generation of internet users became over exposed to scandals and atrocities so they became hyper-vocal and reactive to any new scandals.
Yeah it's cancer. It was also cancer when religious zealots cancelled everything they disagreed with.
| >>730050
The difference is that religious zealots believe in dogmas that are based on *suprise* religion. Religious dogmas are way more random and open to tyranny, oligarchy and mob stupidity compared to ideas based on reason, science and humanism. Of course those things can be abused to, but there is a difference between good ideas being abused and ideas which are rotten from the core.
This also is applicable to difference between far right and left ideologies.
| There is a difference between an overreaction/having wrong priorities regarding actual problems and promoting ideas that are totally detached from reality.
In other words, my problem with the political...
...left, is that they have wrong priorities or just don't do what they say as soon they are in power.
...right is that they believe in entirely made up bullshit and do exactly what they say as soon they are in power.
It feels like a choice between hypocrites and assholes.
| Age gap rhetoric is toxic infantilizes adults. Most of the types with uwu pastel profiles, picrews and the like are fucking savage.
Give it a few years and they will team up with anti porn tradcaths
| I find it ironic to see people with "acab" and "Abolish prisons" in their bios getting off on being wannabie cops and wanting to bring brutal mob justice down on people over any minor slight and I bet a lot of them don't give a fuck about rehabilitative justice, it's just a rush for them doing it.
They just don't have the balls to admit it.
| >>730167 I think these people legitimately believe in rehabilitative justice, but the internet really encourages a retributive mindset. There are some articles on how web 2.0 functions that I should really dig up, but essentially social media is deliberately crafted in a way that pushes information that makes people angry, because it has to be to make user-generated content profitable.
| Angry Burg makes da money, honey
| I recommend you all to study the relation between Marketing, PR and Propaganda. At some point you will stumble over an also politically very interesting personality: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Bernays
Nevertheless you could always have a constructive debate about the methods.
But as soon it comes to the goals things get complicated, since most people have a a view on world and humanity limited by subjective experiences heavily influenced by irrational fears and desires.
| It's a fact that hypocrites, liars, schemers and conspiracies exist. But there are some popular thought errors in using such phenomenon as an argument:
- Such accusations may be the realizations of this phenomenons.
- It is ad-hominem. What X said isn't false because he did Y. And if Y says Y it isn't true only because Y is honest about it and opposing X.
- There are more important, better analyzable and systematical enveloping/core issues.
| >>730167
>They just don't have the balls to admit it.
So shouldn't we be more concerned about those who actually have "the balls" to admit such things? I'm more afraid of a criminal who believes (or at least tries to make others believe) his criminality as legitimate than a criminal who knows exactly that he's acting wrong and tries to hide it. Or of a society which only has the law of jungle.
Again the typical useless "hyporcite"=bad "honest asshole"=good ad-hominem non-argument.
| The thing about a 19 dating a 16 is that its only legal if they were dating before one of them became 18. The law that allows this is aptly named the Romeo and Juliet law.
| >>731211
In most parts of Europe this scenario would be legal, even if dating would imply having sex (which doesn't):
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of_consent_in_Europe
| >>731007 I don't respect ether assholes I just hate self righteous fuax ideologies they pretend to care about.
| >>731482 Or action for action sake with zero thought or hashing things out while pretending its about ideals while creating a passed off mob that will end with ruined lives and suicides
| >>731482
On the other hand as soon people start doing action they are criticized for being (re-)actionistic - which isn't illegitimate.
| So there are as well good ideals as there are good actions. Good ideals don't prevent people from doing bad actions. There may be good actions without any deeper ideals behind it. But I don't believe in good actions caused by bad ideals. Sounds more like a cheap excuse for being an asshole which is even worse to someone wanting good but doing bad.
| However I suspect most of you never had to deal with MASSIVE assholes that are ready to walk over corpses to reach their goals (or at least to keep the status quo). But those people exist. How you suggest dealing with them? Are you always turning the other cheek?
| >>731491 the biggest problem when dealing with people doing things in a inhumane way is trying to do something about it without being inhumane.
This is a huge problem that people are taking sides on, there was elections, they are cheating, proceeds to riot to try to take over governments, lets be antifacist, proceedst to ask governments to violently enforce antifacists rules, lets stop racism, starts to segretate people under pruvuleged and unprivileged races. People just be like
| And this is why ideals suck when acted uppon with no other mediators, extremism always leads to hipocrisy, people should solve problems by thinking and discussing, not by seeing if it fits their holy rules, this goes for eveybody
And this is why cancel culture is the worst, a mob just decides to act on rage, ideals(despite being good) and ignorance, while not analysing the situation.
| >>731495
As far as I read through this, no one here defended "cancel culture" as something good/productive.
| >>731494
This is the classical "how to fight evil, without becoming evil". The thing is that historically there were extreme situations which somehow justified extreme measurements.
The big question that comes to my head is, how can so extreme positions become so popular at the same time we have managed to develop awesome technology and generating an incredible amount of affluence of goods in the world.
| conclusion: cancel culture should be cancelled. next
| >>731509 because first: not all places and people can use that technology
Second:information can be manipulated
And third: its just a natural chaotic tendency that people wont all agree on one thing.
| Cancel cancel culture indeed
| >>731510
I think that's too easy. Isn't "cancel culture" also some kind of peaceful protest? I mean it's not like someone gets murdered or something.
| >>731506 guess you were wrong lmaoooo.
>>731515 sure, but people are loosing jobs, internet services, getting their names thrown under the mud, relationships destroyed, families doxxed, having documents and private info leaked and etc.
If destroying someones life over an uninvestigated accusation is peaceful to you then idk what to tell you.
| To me "cancel culture" is entirely an upper class/1st world problem. To be honest I couldn't care less. I'm not interested in people being affected by it as they aren't interested in my stupid lower class issues.
| >>731520 I live in third world country, it is a problem, teens get canceled online, adults get canceled online and even kids, ther ehave been cases of suicide and death threats
| You are dont care not because it is a rich people problem, you dont care because you dont know any cases near you and cant see how this is a problem that is happening all over the internet
| >>731519
People loose their jobs anyways thanks to automation and offshoring.
Most internet services aren't necessary to have a decent live. In the opposite: Most of them cause, dependency, depression and brainwashing by marketing and propaganda.
Relationships are being reduced to business relationships, traditional family is dying out for good reasons and privacy is fucked up. In other words: Our lives are going to be destroyed anyways for different reasons than "cancel culture".
| In my country people are canceled for being socialists, gay or immigrants. But our government does't call it "cancel culture". They call it "defending our culture/country/values" - and with "our" they only mean those who agree with them.
| >>731523 some people work on the internet, companies search you up on the internet to see if you are a good to employ, interntet has a part in our daily lives you like it or not
| >>731530 sounds like you are excusing cancel culture because "uh me country has it worse than yours" wich is just pathetic.
| >>731531
>some people work on the internet
No they don't. Dotcom bubble 2.0 is in progress and will burst massively.
| >>731819 ok the fact that your arguement now is "internet is not a real job and they will all colapse" is just idiotic, you could say that about any work in any industry.
| >>731820
>you could say that about any work in any industry.
Well, I can't see anything wrong about this.
| great thread guys, hit the showers
This thread is permanently archived
| Apparently 12th graders dating 10th graders are pedophile groomers like??????