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some thoughts on the Israel/Palestine confict
| >>282872 the conflict is more the aftermath of British colonial policy (Balfour declaration) and treating the Palestinians as an afterthought when considering the region's future (Arabs made up around 40% of Israel in 1947 pre-nakba); rather than anything a continuation of cold war.
| It's bronze age cultures that didn't have to change in order to get modern technology.
| free Palestine from Jewish occupation
| The middle east is the asshole of our planet.
| >>283787
A driver behind the British colonial policy were trading companies. And anti-colonialism and anticapitalism played a big role for liberation movents in the third world during the cold war.
| >>283810
I doubt we changed that much in the west. Under the surface of democracy and humanism operates a social economic ideology which is not just independent from but also stands in contradiction to this ethical values.
| I'd say this is a product of the Israeli themselves. The British Empire was supposed to divide the territory into 2 nations, Israel and Palestine. The Israeli refused this offer and over the years continued with heavy policy. Hitler's regime is critiqued for genocide yet the kikes in Israel get to get away with it because of US connections. Seriously, fuck Israel.
| >not the Jew not the Jew not the Jews
Clearly this is the fault of "capitalism"!
| It's for economic purposes, of course.
| >>284038 I don't remember private enterprise being the main driving force behind how mandatory Palestine was handled, though your analysis of Colonial policy (not only British), as well as the Third World's liberation from it is correct.
| >>284370
It was no particular company. The USA just needed an outpost in the near east. They equipped conservative anti-soviet reactionist israelis with weapons and supported them in many other ways. They did the same in Asia and South- & Central- America. The only difference is, they also supported islamist fundamentalists who became a major enemy to Israel. Btw. in Asia the USA supported the red kmehr to fuck once more the Vietnamese who liberated cambodia.
| >>284794
The important thing is: USA foreign policy is driven by economic and ideologic interests of big fat companies like oil or military-industry. This is the major reason why almost only religious lunatics, autocrats and nationalists are left in the near east. They persecuted, opressed and murdered everyone suspected as secular and internationalist socialist.
They only exception here is the kurds, which in Syria got dropped like a hot potato after they did the dirty work.
| >>3d6bef I guess it must be Mandela Effect but I thought Sharia Law nations still behead gays and apostates. And executions for witchcraft and heresy. Oh wait, they actually do.
| >>285067
Well, if there was no political left in "western" countries it would be the same here. And these ugly things will come back as the rise of right continues.
The thing is that the political left in 3rd world was persecuted systematicly by western marionets. It's just ridiculous how the right-wingers in the west, who are against "the Islam", don't realize that they are no better and their ideological-political predecessors have much responsibility for the rise of islamism.
| Another though:
Why don't the israeli military first try out non-lethal weapons to protect their fence against raging palestinian civilists before shooting at them with lethal ones? Don't they have gum projectiles, water cannons and tear gas? Is there any risk for them using it?
| >>b37cdd can't argue against that (same person as>>5719bf) though I would just stop at the military industrial complex and the oil industry (though you do only have 500 character limit).
| >>c29743 it's cute how you call those things ugly ibstead of human rights violations. But hey, blame the west for Islam's radicalization when Islam has only Islam to blame. They've been this way for centuries. When was the last state sanctioned execution in the west of a gay person BECAUSE they were gay?
| >>286196
Maybe if Britian kept the promise of giving the arabian peninsula to the moderate sunni instead of abandoning them for the Whabist. But you know keep pretending colonialism didn't happen.
| >>286196
>Islam has only Islam to blame
Ok, let's forget about the active support of islamists by the british and germans during WW1 and by the US during (and after) cold war.
>They've been this way for centuries.
The golden age was 500yrs.
>When was the last state sanctioned execution in the west of a gay person BECAUSE they were gay?
80 years maximum. Also in 2016 the USA did NOT sign a UN-resolution to condemn death-penalty for things like homosexual acts, adultery or blasphemy.
| >>286233
https://www.nbcnews.com/feature/nbc-out/following-backlash-us-clarifies-un-vote-death-penalty-gays-n807151
| >>b37cdd Are you saying they'd be as tolerant of gays as the west if not for that? And oh what a golden age it was, being ended by a cleric that wanted to have a more literal and by the book interpretation. How deluded you are, blaming the west for a shitty bronze age culture being a shitty bronze age culture. But you do have a point, they should be isolated from the world until they sort out their primitive culture into something more liberal.
| >>287009
>being ended by a cleric that wanted to have a more literal and by the book interpretation.
If you believe this was the real cause, then you are dumb as shit. A single cleric does not change history on his own. There are always political-econmical interests in the background. In the case of the islamic world it was simmiliar to the european conflict between monarchs and the popes. The conquest of the america by europeans was the final cause to end the golden age of islam.
| >>287240
the same is also on martin luther and his reformation. Without support by the princes of the HRE against pope and emperor, plus the block printing technology, there would never have been a reformation. Also todays lutherans and evangelicans are a little behind and pretty similiar to orthodox/conservative muslims. It's never good if someone takes a book literally, since world, circumstances and even meaning of words and phrases change - even in high-arab language.
| >>287009
but interesting that you contrast "liberal" vs. "primitive" culture, as the most of todays western anti-muslim and anti-islam douchebags are anti-liberal too. What a poor opposition. "Hey don't eat this muslim shit, our patriot-nationalist-racist-christfundamentalist shit tastes much better" What a joke.
| >>287009
Your denying of the bad influnce by western foreign policy on the 3rd, including the islamic world, is so ridicolous. "Uh we are so progressive and have nothing to do with the rest of the world"
>types on a device with ressources from africa with chinese labour, delivered with oil from near-east while eating fish from african coast triggering real piracy, while proclaiming about bad influnce of online "piracy" on the market.
Yeah thats probably you, fcking 1st world cunt!
| >>287247
>>287251
I'm not the guy you are responding to, but how do you survive on a daily basis being this retarded? Do you have an assistant?
| Uh guys,how about we talk without having to include an insult to another person like civilized people
| >>f394d7 my oh my you seem upset that you're losing the debate. As Dick Dawkins once asked, "What is the penalty for apostasy in the Quran?" And "bad influences the west had on Islam are a drop in the Ocean the bad influence that is Islam. You also seem to confuse China as a western country. Sorry you don't live in reality, gwailo.
| >>288224 it sounds like the dick sucking, had a eurocentric view of not only the world but also how imperialism shaped it, and it's history. Also he isn't saying that China is First world nation he is talking about how the West exploits the World and it's people you dumb fuck.
| >>287712 This is /news/, g/u/rl. I stop by once in a while to strenghten my misanthropic resolve. It might not be the place for you if mindless squabbles that go nowhere aren't your thing.
| >>95907e
Get upset more that you lost the plot and the argument. Please by all means, send more angry insults my way. Maybe when you're done here you can go be an openly gay witch in Saudi Arabia. Good luck at keeping your head attached. In the west you won't be beheaded for something like that. Because a modern and civilized culture will always be better that a bronze age one.
| >>289215
Funny how you have to rely on the wahabi state for your examples. There are branches of Islam where its okay to be trans so long as you are gay. But please keep pointing to islamic kkk. "But sa is a goberment support blah blah blah."
Yeah and West boro and KKK would try the same shit if they had power.
Oh and heres a christian country where you would be jailed RUSSIA and the look away when its murder for that reasom
| >>290033
I doubt you really know what "sharia" is or means. Can you explain it, or give a link to "the sharia"?
Ofc. clerics would deny it, but in the end it's all about interpretation. When it comes to practise islamists give a shit about Qur'an and sharia. They just do what is necessary to stay in power. And as in this world capital and materialism is the key to power also leaders of the islamic world have to follow this path. Religion is used as opium for ppl, not only in islam.
| >>93059d
You want a link to Islamic Law in the Qur'an?
>>blah blah clerics don't control the people blah blah I'm talking out of my ass.
You're right, and that's why I said you should try being openly gay in any state where Sharia is law. At this point you've not countered my point and only worked more to cement your ignorance.
| Israel is here to stay, even if the way it was founded wasn't agreeable. Middle eastern people have to get used to that. They will forever have enemies if they don't revert back to the pre 6day war territories. If they do, groups like Hamas will lose support for wanting more war. I'm sure people there on both sides are sick of the fighting and just want it to be done with.
Just need to stop the Hawks on both sides
| >>292350
Not really.
You're honestly pretty fucking stupid because you're just using whataboutism to pretend to have a point.
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| I personally think this conflict is just another rotten fruit of cold war, were western capitalist powers suceed dividing people in a region where "socialism" became a pretty big thing.
They supported and raised at first israeli nationalists and later arab islamists. Now there is nearly nothing left of political movements, which want to unite people as people. Only lunatic religious, nationalist and racist zealots and no one is questioning capitalism itself.